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Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly

RandyPAlex
New Poster

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly

Thanks. I’ll post results.
It occurs to me that unless I have something constantly trying to pull a little bit down then there are no data transactions from which to have round trip transport delays. True?
Does the router itself send periodic packets that would suffice to stimulate the RTT errors if it is substantial?
MrBuster
Senior

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly


@RandyPAlex wrote:
Thanks. I’ll post results.
It occurs to me that unless I have something constantly trying to pull a little bit down then there are no data transactions from which to have round trip transport delays. True?
Does the router itself send periodic packets that would suffice to stimulate the RTT errors if it is substantial?

Yes, even when nothing is connected there is some minimal activity (appears to be 2 packets a minute) that allows gathering basic metrics about issues, but as you can imagine, more data used does give a better idea.  I had wondered if this was using my data, but in my testing it appears HughesNet does not count these packets toward your limits as far as I can tell since 120 GSE Packets an hour should use up 1 MByte over a couple of hours causing a minimal measurable usage and I do not see that happening when the box is on with no devices over the course of a day.

 

In the posted pic, the weather event from 3-4 am (9 GMT) was recorded as a downlink issue, but no devices were using data, and the RTT I shown would have been 9pm-10pm and I was not using the system.

 

I think starting from here helps to know if there is even a problem before getting deep into testing.

 

 

MarkJFine
Associate Professor

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly

@MrBuster 

Have to say, that's probably the best explanation I've seen on how to interpret the diagnostics page. Many people tend to ignore those. This may be the first time I've seen it put to good use. 👍🏼


* Disclaimer: I am a HughesNet customer and not a HughesNet employee. All of my comments are my own and do not necessarily represent HughesNet in any way.
GabeU
Distinguished Professor IV

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly

@MrBuster 

 

Just out of pure curiosity, how were you able to alter those pics of the same time intervals?  I thought maybe paint, but that would be FAR too tedious.


Ryzen 5 3400G | MSI B450M Pro-M2 MAX | 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3000 | XPG SX8200 Pro 512GB NVMe | Windows 10 Pro
GabeU
Distinguished Professor IV

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly


@MarkJFine wrote:

@MrBuster 

Have to say, that's probably the best explanation I've seen on how to interpret the diagnostics page. Many people tend to ignore those. This may be the first time I've seen it put to good use. 👍🏼


Agreed. I also had no idea what RTT stood for, but even further, what it meant on that table.


Ryzen 5 3400G | MSI B450M Pro-M2 MAX | 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3000 | XPG SX8200 Pro 512GB NVMe | Windows 10 Pro
MrBuster
Senior

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly


@GabeU wrote:

@MrBuster 

 

Just out of pure curiosity, how were you able to alter those pics of the same time intervals?  I thought maybe paint, but that would be FAR too tedious.


Yeah -- I used paint, draw a rectangle around an X then ctrl-drag to each spot.  With a little practice, even a person with shaky hands like me can manage as long as you do not look too close :-) 

 

HughesNet seems to offer a lot of data salted away under weird places and odd links which are very handy for tracking things down, but I can see how giving an explanation can be hard.  I used a different satellite internet before and they did not seem to have as much detail available.

 

 

GabeU
Distinguished Professor IV

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly


@MrBuster wrote:

Yeah -- I used paint, draw a rectangle around an X then ctrl-drag to each spot.  With a little practice, even a person with shaky hands like me can manage as long as you do not look too close :-) 

HughesNet seems to offer a lot of data salted away under weird places and odd links which are very handy for tracking things down, but I can see how giving an explanation can be hard.  I used a different satellite internet before and they did not seem to have as much detail available.


I appluad your tenacity for the purpose of helping others.


Ryzen 5 3400G | MSI B450M Pro-M2 MAX | 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3000 | XPG SX8200 Pro 512GB NVMe | Windows 10 Pro
RandyPAlex
New Poster

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly

Here is what she looks like currently. Not much of an issue with RTT but some of the experienced latency is quite significant. It showed nothing when I started an hour or so ago.diagnostic_history_201912171944GMT-5.PNG

 

It wasn't until I ran the latency test on testmy.net that it stimulated something. HN congestion_201912172217.PNG

 

 

 

 

 

If you read what it says in the latency test, it makes sense to me that it is a better gage of web page latency (TCP; layer 4) than ICMP layer 3 messages like tracert and ping.

It feels more like what I experience in usage too. TCP latency to multiple sites, 20 reps each.TCP latency to multiple sites, 20 reps each.
Latency_201912172212.PNG

 

Since I don't just believe what I read, I ran tracert to many of those same sites in parallel so it could be captured in the wireshark trace I was running. The pcapng file has this kind of gorey detail on the comms through my ethernet port:Wireshark pic 201912172233.PNG

 

Wireshark is a free network analysis tool (https://www.wireshark.org/) with awesome trace capability. 

Is anybody at Hughesnet interested in looking at my trace to see what the source of my frustratingly laggy performance is? I'd be glad to email it to you.

Ultimately, the experience of the user is what HN delivers, not statistics, but stats help us troubleshoot techical issues. My router seems to say I don't have RTT issues (at least not bad enough to trigger the built in fault) and tracert shows quite good response (albeit optimistic layer 3 and below), SO... whatever my issue is seems to be  in the TCP layer above it or in the gateway or the external site. Since I captured tracerts to those same sites and they too show <1000ms speeds unless they just bombed ("*"), this would say the connection to them is fast enough (by ICMP judgement). And yet TCP is laggy. All the data is in the PCAPNG file.   I'm really not trying to be a jerk. I'm just an engineer looking for answers based on data. 

 

RandyPAlex
New Poster

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly

I appreciate any suggestions out there that lead to greater insight on this issue.

Since this is a community tech support site I assume there is only so much that kind volunteers can do as opposed to paid HN employees if I call tech support there. I guess that is my next step. 

MarkJFine
Associate Professor

Re: Latency highly variable but bad for simple browsing - several seconds regularly

I can't unfurl what's going on in that wireshark trace. But it's looking more and more like it's Century Link causing the problem. If you do a simple traceroute to something common like microsoft.com and post it here I can probably tell by the 4th or 5th hop if that's it.


* Disclaimer: I am a HughesNet customer and not a HughesNet employee. All of my comments are my own and do not necessarily represent HughesNet in any way.