HughesNet Community

Echostar 19 and ping

cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
mcmjlm23
New Member

Echostar 19 and ping

I recently connected with hughesnet expecting subpar Internet speeds. Coming to find out, it's worse than subpar. My latency is between 700-1200ms! Even if the download speed hits over 20mpbs (which has only happened one time when it was installed), the Internet is still considered continental drift slow, simply because the latency is ultra slow, making any form of chat or real time impossible.

With that being said, I read up on the echostar 19 and the new gen5 plans and how bandwidth could hit a potential of 200mbps (which is even impressive for cable internet). So my question is, after echostar 19 and the new gen5 plans are set and ready to go, what about the ping? Will the ping be any faster? Or the same snail speed of over 500ms? Thanks
- Matt
18 REPLIES 18
Gwalk900
Honorary Alumnus

Ping is a function of the speed of light and distance. Echostar 19 will be at an altitude of 22,300 mles. The same as all geo sync satellites.
C0RR0SIVE
Associate Professor

Yeup yeup, latency will never be much below ~650ms on average.  Typically you will see between 700ms and 1400ms depending on what service you are connecting to when it comes to satellite internet.

As for the download speeds... That 200Mbps is the theoretical maximum of the modems and would require an enterprise account (more than anyone here makes in a year per month!) to obtain.
Amanda
Moderator

Hi mcmjlm23,
Our champs have given you the right answer! The latency (ping) is only high because of the time it takes to travel from your home to  the satellite in geosynchronous orbit, to a land gateway, back up, then to your home again. It is a long road and is a trait of satellite technology.  Let us know if you have any other questions.

Thanks
Amanda
mcmjlm23
New Member

So with that being said, it's misleading to say hughesnet is fast, when it takes so long to load a page simply because the latency is so long. I was thinking the latency wouldn't be as long as it really is.. not really happy with what I was led to believe
curtis-m
Sophomore

The solution to this is, unfortunately, several years off. Space X plans to launch over 4000 low orbit satellites starting, perhaps a bit optimistically, in 2018. Because these will be low orbit satellites, the latency issue will be a thing of the past.

If Space X can pull this off, then I would think there would be some service available from them in 2019 or 2020.

O3b is already doing this but they have only launched a few satellites and their focus is more toward areas that have either no or very limited internet access such as Africa and Latin America.  
El Dorado Netwo
Advanced Tutor

So with that being said, it's misleading to say hughesnet is fast, when it takes so long to load a page simply because the latency is so long.
How long is it taking a page to load? Can you give an example? You may have another issue besides normal satellite latency.
I was thinking the latency wouldn't be as long as it really is.. not really happy with what I was led to believe
Let to believe this by who? Was this something you read or was it something you were told?
El Dorado Networks |Diamond Springs, CA | eldoradonetworks.com
C0RR0SIVE
Associate Professor

They have been talking about LEO Sat Net for the better part of 20 years (Not SpaceX, but technology companies overall).  It's not going to really take off like some expect I think.  Musk thinks it will be ~25ms, but I have serious doubts it will be that low once everyone tries to get those 1Gbps plans he touts as being available.  Imagine if everyone could get a 1Gbps service plan at 25ms, virtually every ISP would be put out of business, but we already know that those satellites will have individual throughput limitations, and they will probably be rather low.

As for O3b, they plan only 20 satellites world-wide, each one caps under 15Gbps, and maximum throughput is about 2Mbps on those satellites for each connection.  To top it off, they are not LEO, they are MEO, so latency is rather... bad.  They are more of a commercial provider than anything as well.


I am all for LEO, but everyone keeps forgetting something, a bird can only handle so much capacity, and LEO sats will have to be replaced rather frequently.  No company has actually made residential LEO service that's affordable and profitable while providing a good service, so good luck to whoever accomplishes it, if they can.
El Dorado Netwo
Advanced Tutor

chuckr47
New Poster

Most Geostationary Orbit (GSO) satellites are at an altitude of approximately 35,786 km above the equator.  I really wonder about the altitude HughesNet is using,  when they quote a delay of  700 ms to 1400 ms - perhaps it is the extra delays I talk about below.

if you are located on the equator and are communicating with a satellite directly overhead then the total distance, single hop  (up and down) is nearly 72,000 km so the time delay is 240 ms( speed of light is 300,000 km per second).   mS means millisecond or 1 thousandth of a second so 240 mS is just under a quarter of a second.

Extra delays occur due to the length of cable extensions at either end, and very much so if a signal is routed by more than one satellite hop.

Significant delay can also be added in routers, switches and signal processing points along the route.

Note. If you are located at the edges of a geosync satellite's coverage, you can expect approximately 280 ms delay.

GabeU
Distinguished Professor IV

With the exception of a few things, like online fast turn games and/or VPNs, a latency of 700ms isn't going to have much of an important effect.  With most everything people do using internet access, three quarters of a second isn't all that important.  

Are you using the net for something in which a 700ms latency causes concern?  
 

Ryzen 5 3400G | MSI B450M Pro-M2 MAX | 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3000 | XPG SX8200 Pro 512GB NVMe | Windows 10 Pro
BirdDog
Assistant Professor

It is a one way system so 4 trips to complete a roundtrip communication. Up to satellite, back to ground gateway and internet, back up to satellite and finally back to you. So 4 times 22.3K miles.
BirdDog
Assistant Professor

Theoretical fastest latency is around 500ms but yes, there is delay in the equipment side and the internet.
El Dorado Netwo
Advanced Tutor

Most Geostationary Orbit (GSO) satellites are at an altitude of approximately 35,786 km above the equator.  I really wonder about the altitude HughesNet is using,  when they quote a delay of  700 ms to 1400 ms - perhaps it is the extra delays I talk about below.
All Geostationary satellites are very close to this height or, by definition, they would not be geo-stationary. HughesNet satellites are geo-stationary, so they are at the same altitude as other geo-stationary satellites.
Note. If you are located at the edges of a geosync satellite's coverage, you can expect approximately 280 ms delay.
Per Birdog, this is not correct. To complete the 90.000 mile round trip circuit to the NOC and back, minimum latency will be at least double this figure. 
El Dorado Networks |Diamond Springs, CA | eldoradonetworks.com
donsjgm
Junior

light doesn't travel at 300,000 km/s in an atmosphere, only in an open vacuum such as space. Air slows it down, the value for air is 1.00054. Although it's only a small amount (btw moisture can make a much larger difference) when you multiply it by the distances involved the time increases more than you previously calculated.

Don  🙂
curtis-m
Sophomore

Space X has leased a 42,000sq ft building near Seattle and either is or will be hiring engineers. They are very serious about this and plan to use revenues to fund their Mars missions and colonization.

Through Project Fi, I have wifi calling but due to Hughes' latency it's of no use to me. I can call or receive calls from understanding friends but if I try to call anyone else, including my dentist, they will hang up before I can say anything because they think it's a bogus call. Thank you Hughes Net.

The idea of being able to make calls with no noticeable latency in my remote location is super appealing to me but it would also be appealing to anyone anywhere who has wifi enabled calling on their phones.
El Dorado Netwo
Advanced Tutor

Through Project Fi, I have wifi calling but due to Hughes' latency it's of no use to me. I can call or receive calls from understanding friends but if I try to call anyone else, including my dentist, they will hang up before I can say anything because they think it's a bogus call. Thank you Hughes Net.
There are several VoIP applications, and many were not designed to work with the natural latency and higher "jitter" over a satellite connection. This is a problem not just with HughesNet.

Some third-party VoIP services work better (read "less worse') over satellite than others; SKYPE and Net2Phone are two.

HughesNet has always expressly disclaimed support for VoIP, other than their own HughesNet Voice service. And they have no control how third parties design their VoIP apps.
El Dorado Networks |Diamond Springs, CA | eldoradonetworks.com
GabeU
Distinguished Professor IV

That's interesting.  It's an example of where it could be a problem that I had never thought of, but I can certainly understand it.  If I receive a call and don't get a confirmation to my "hello" right away I assume it's a robo call and hang up.  
 

Ryzen 5 3400G | MSI B450M Pro-M2 MAX | 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3000 | XPG SX8200 Pro 512GB NVMe | Windows 10 Pro